Under ordinary circumstances, Joe Biden's latest speaking gaffe wouldn't be a big deal. But these aren't ordinary circumstances:
It doesn't matter if Biden had trouble reading the teleprompter. Maybe he needs glasses. Who cares?
But he shouldn't need a teleprompter to know that his own policy, which he was announcing for the first time, was to limit rent increases to 5%, not $55. How could he possibly not remember that?
Coming a day after he mumbled his way through an interview with Lester Holt, this very much suggests that Biden's debate performance wasn't just "a bad night." He needs to face up to facts and resign the presidency before it's too late.
I actually agree with you that Biden should drop out. But this is an odd example since presumably it is not a matter of him misremembering, but his reading off of a teleprompter with the $ looking like a 5 to him.
Yeah, I don't find this concerning at all. Dude misread/misspoke. It happens all the time to people everywhere.
This is backwards, he'd have been reading 5% as 55. In fact I wonder if there was a typo, since % is shift-5. Still, he should know the policy.
time to find a norway maple, a dry martini, and a big ol' fatty
maybe get some raybans to protect my eyes while i watch it all burn
You're gonna burn the Norway maple, right?
no acer platanoides will be harmed in any of my fantasies
otoh, an ailanthus altissima will get what's coming to 'em
He needs to face up to facts and resign the presidency before it's too late.
And then?
Who should be the nominee? And why -- in detail please -- would that be better?
Why and how would s/he be able to withstand the inevitable, predictable attacks on him/her? How would the party deal with the inevitable mischief by red-state elections officials? If it's anybody but Harris, how would s/he access the campaign funds? And if it IS Harris, how will she deal with the deep, pervasive misogyny, racism, and xenophobia that pretty much defines contemporary Republicanism?
It's just not enough for all the hand-wringers to run around in circles screaming "Joe must go!!11!!" What's the plan, and why is it better than the present situation?
Otherwise, this is just panic (or worse, sabotage), it ain't helping anybody except the Felon, and I gotta admit I'm getting sick of it.
Well given that Kevin is on the "resign the presidency" train (which is such a baffling position to take), I guess his implied plan is Harris.
Well given that Kevin is on the "resign the presidency" train (which is such a baffling position to take...
Apparently it's not baffling to the overwhelming majority of Democrats (yes, "Democrats" — not "Americans").
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4777452-democrats-biden-drop-out-ap-poll-trump-assassination-attempt/
I see Adam Schiff came out today to urge Biden to step aside. And the president himself appeared to be showing some flexibility on this issue:
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/17/biden-medical-interview-election-00169050
Know hope!
That’s about ALL the “Joe must go” types have. Cuz they sure don’t have a plan!
It may not be deliberate sabotage, but the effect is the same. At a minimum they could just STFU
What? The plan is to get a younger, more articulate candidate in place after the convention. Adam Schiff is no political or intellectual neophyte. Remember, he was the Democrats main man in the second impeachment of Trump.
And now Schumer:
Schumer told Biden he should end reelection bid, ABC News reports
By Reuters
Schiff has 0 days as Senator, so yes, he's not a new ie but he's also not a senior in the party.
Asking Biden to drop out of the race is a defensible position, asking Biden to resign the Presidency is a batshit crazy proposition. Shame on Kevin for jumping the shark in this manner. I used to think he was a smart man. Not anymore.
Said poll also had 57% of voters wanting Donald Trump to drop out too. Good gravy are folks bad at understanding what the polling data is telling us. Folks are always ever hopeful for a shinny new thing until the thing becomes real a shitified by the opposing party.
As has been mentioned before, a lot of Trump voters know what an idiot he is and even call him unsuitable to be prez in interview after interview, but they plan to vote for him anyway. Unfortunately for Joe, his voters have to actually think of him as being able to do the job. That’s the real problem with polls like this. Asking “do you think he can do the job” or “do you want him to drop out” means little when it comes to Trump voters.
For a lot of voters, Joe has to convince them that he can do the job; Trump doesn’t.
From the Politico article you linked to:
President Joe Biden would reevaluate his decision to stay in the presidential race if doctors told him he had a medical issue, he said in an interview with BET News.
Biden has Covid.
The stage has possibly been set for Joe retire as a hero. (With a little pressure from his friends)
The stage has possibly been set for Joe retire as a hero. (With a little pressure from his friends)
I think we're indeed seeing the beginning of the end.
"Stepping aside" is not the same as "resign the presidency RIGHT NOW."
+1 and trump's mental issues should have been an issue all along, as well as his specific statements about being a dictator getting rid of the Constitution, etc. Maybe some don't care (or care to understand) policy issues or economic ones, but lame Democratic messaging, combined with public piling on both Biden. & Harris - few acknowledge what she brought to the ticket, even though bigotry may prevent her from becoming president on. her own - are as much of a problem as Biden's verbal mistakes.
While it was better seeing Republicans in disarray in the House for a while, the unanimity of all of trump's former opponents, including McConnell, Haley, Vance. makes the failure of Democrats other than Biden is disgusting.
Classic Trump. It was reported that he changed his schedule to ensure that he was there in person and up close when the losers kissed up to him. Usual Trump class.
Every alternative democrat outpolls Biden
https://www.politico.com/newsletters/playbook/2024/07/17/new-polling-bolsters-dump-biden-push-00168943
Those ate magical thinking candidates at this point. Might as well poll how a unicorn would do if Democrats nominated one. If anyone but Biden is nominated, those numbers are going to drop considerably.
That may well be, but any reasonably glib, articulate, and quick-thinking pol should be able to mop the floor with Trump. They guy is just such an easy target! Not a day goes by that he doesn't say something utterly bonkers that should make the airways as a sign of his ignorance, mental decline, bigotry, corrupt intent, and/or fealty to Putin. Hell, -I- could mop the floor with him in a debate, and I'm only seven years younger than Donnie! Joe had a great term, and whether he really is in mental decline or not - and I'm not convinced he is - he's really not the candidate we need right now.
That may well be, but any reasonably glib, articulate, and quick-thinking pol should be able to mop the floor with Trump.
It's been so long since we've had a presidential election featuring two sharp communicators (I reckon 2012) that Americans have discounted the value of simple, effective, crisp communication at the summit of our politics.
Weirdly cherry picked.
+1
There is a process for choosing the nominee for the Democratic Party, and it sure ain't "listen to the pundits and follow their advice while ignoring the real process."
There are two criteria for choosing a POTUS candidate. The "must have" need is someone who will serve the country. Biden passes with flying colors and Trump fails miserably. The highest priority "nice to have" want is competence. Biden passes with flying colors and Trump fails miserably. The lowest priority "nice to have" want is the ability to translate one's thoughts into words that are an accurate reflection of those thoughts. Neither candidate is great, but who cares?
Now, if Biden was an entertainer, the criteria would be different, but politics is not entertainment no matter how many wishes people make.
There are two plans. The easy one is to default to Kamala Harris. The harder one is to select a new nominee at an open convention.
To your specific questions:
1. The candidate might or might not withstand the inevitable attacks, just like Biden might or might not withstand the attacks he is currently facing. I don't see what this has to do with anything.
2. Right now, as far as the laws for ballot access and so forth are concerned, there is no difference between Biden and anyone else. The Democratic Party does not have a nominee yet. Picking a different nominee at the convention creates no special openings for mischief.
3. Fo a non-Harris replacement, the Biden campaign transfers its money to the DNC, which can then use it to fund other campaigns. Parties do this all the time to invest in strategically important races. In this case, the DNC would be using that money to fund the new candidate's campaign.
4. If Harris is the replacement, then racism and misogyny and the rest will certainly be a drag on the ticket. However, Biden's age and lapses are also a serious drag -- and to the extent the public sees Harris as likely to replace Biden in the next four years, racism and misogyny are pulling us down already anyway.
There are no good options or safe bets here. Replacing Biden is a gamble and could go very badly. But keeping Biden is *also* a gamble, and is *already* going very badly. I was strongly against replacing Biden for a long time, but it has reached the point where it makes more sense to roll the dice than to stick it out.
Personally, I prefer the open convention to a Harris coronation. If we are going to take the risk of swapping out our nominee, we should try to maximize the potential upside; better the possibility of a strong candidate than the certainty of a so-so one. But I would still take Harris over Biden.
Lol. No x 5
1. Why would another candidate -- a specific candidate, please -- be better? Name your candidate and explain why the attacks on him/her would be LESS damaging than the attacks on Biden. And also why his/her advantages would be at least as good or better than Biden's. You don't see what this has to do with anything?! It's the whole race FFS.
2. Really? And you are an expert on the election laws of al 50 states? States have primaries. What happens when some red-state AG says nonono, the vote is binding, no other candidate can appear on that party's ticket in this state. Dems sue, it all gets tied up in court, and maybe even the state's Supremes say nope, can't change the Will Of The Voters. And that's just off the top of my head. Assuming the DNC controls who appears on state ballots is naive at best.
3. Oh nonono. Even *I* know enough to know that there are different categories of money, and that money donated to a candidate is very different from money donated to a party (or even more so, a PAC). Different in what it can be used for, different in how it has to be accounted for -- "just transfer it to the DNC and use it for whoever" is silly hand-waving.
4. And to ask again, why is one worse than the other? I never hear any responses to this, only "aaaah! Biden bad! aaaah!"
5. An "open convention"?!?! Yes, for sure, a free-for-all will DEFINITELY unify the party!! Brilliant idea! Underpants gnomes squared!
But thank you at least for responding. Most people just don't.
Bbleh, as far as I know, the primary results aren't legally binding. There are no laws governing this. So Republican AGs can get their panties in a twist, but what's their legal recourse? The Democratic Party violated a rule that they... {checks notes...} invented for themselves? That's a little like sending Bob to jail because he decided it was casual Thursday. (Not that Bob -shouldn't- be sent to jail; he most certainly should! But not for that reason.)
If your name is Bob, sorry about that. "Kevin" was taken.
All true, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen anyway. By the time its been all the way up the SCOTUS, Trump is president ...
1. The attack currently hitting Biden is that he appears to be suffering serious impairment due to his age. Voters have been signaling for years that this is a big concern for them. Pretty much any of the other candidates being considered (Harris, Whitmer, Shapiro, etc.) is immune to this and could even flip it around on Trump.
The Republicans' other main line of attack is the inflation that happened on Biden's watch. This would also work on Harris. It would be less effective against Whitmer or Shapiro, since they were not in the administration.
2. What election law, in a swing state (not a red state) controlled by Republicans, allows them to kick the Democratic nominee off the ballot because convention delegates changed their votes?
3. This is established precedent. Michael Bloomberg had $18 million in his campaign account when he dropped out in the 2020 primary. He transferred the whole thing directly to the DNC, and the Federal Election Commission ruled this was legit. If he can do it, so can Biden.
4. Biden is worse at this point because he has little chance of positive surprises and a big chance of negative surprises. He's not going to suddenly turn out to be a much better campaigner. But he could very easily have another "bad night" like the debate and completely tank his chances.
Harris is more of an unknown. She might turn out to be a much better presidential campaigner than anyone expects. She could also turn out to be a complete dud. But when you're losing, shaking up the race is better than hunkering down.
5. This doesn't deserve a response and won't get one.
There are two plans. The easy one is to default to Kamala Harris. The harder one is to select a new nominee at an open convention.
I think that's overly binary. We don't know exactly how the process will transpire—and in fairness that's something of a risk for Democrats—but there's a medium between "open political brawl in Chicago" and "coronation of Harris."
I think if the president drops out of the race, Harris is overwhelmingly likely to prevail in becoming the nominee, but it's conceivable there could be an open convention where she's nominated on, say, the second or third ballot. Anything's possible, sure, but I think Democrats are sufficiently aware of the stakes to run a convention that is both competitive (at least somewhat so) and non-vituperative.
Your money plan isn't legal.
Unless you can get someone like The Rock or Michelle Obama to replace him, Biden still has the best chance of winning. We should be encouraging turnout above all else because Trump only wins if the average person decides to stay home on election day.
^ this ^
Ageeed - Newsom is trying to get that done - but even if either those two agreed to run, I doubt that we'd have a winner. And I'd prefer that Democrats win with a serious. seasoned candidate, rather than do as the Republicans have done.
The Rock is a Republican. He's not running. Leave poor Mrs. Obama alone too!
Why do you think Biden has the best chance?
https://www.politico.com/newsletters/playbook/2024/07/17/new-polling-bolsters-dump-biden-push-00168943
The value of incumbency is huge, though by making this a contested issue the dems are ruining another advantage they have.
Normally incumbency is a big advantage. But inflation really, really hurts incumbents.
There was a study on inflation shocks since 1970 (worldwide, not just in the U.S.) which found that an inflation shock had a 58% chance to lead to government turnover. If there was an election within two years of the shock, the chance went up to 75%.
https://abcnews.go.com/Business/inflation-helped-decide-elections-worldwide-means-midterms/story?id=92808587
Why do you think Biden has the best chance?
Because reasons. Lol.
Agree on turnout. And how do they boost turnout when the candidate looks so bad….? (Expecting people to respond to “go vote” is not good enough.)
kevin is like paul campos at LGM, seeing anything to support his theory on Biden not well and not capable of running the country or a campaign.
what are you going to do about it? the dude says he is continuing.
I suppose pout and whine and then tell all the other inmates at the camps “I told you so!”
Does this mean that Mike Johnson should resign too?
Of course, he'll do the honorable thing. Right? In case he doesn't, he'll be next in line should anything happen to President Kamala. That's only until a new veep is approved, which Mike would get to lickety-split. Right? In case he doesn't, no worries, though, because we know the Secret Service offers an impenetrable shield around potential targets. Right?
Worst case, Dems still have a majority in the Senate, so it's not like the GOP could do anything. That 51-49 advantage looks rock solid. Well, Dems would lose the tiebreaker with no veep, and Bob Menendez is getting to retire early. But I don't think there's much to worry about. Right?
After all, Mike Johnson is going to do the honorable thing.
(I assume Kevin's post is entirely tongue in cheek because the alternative doesn't seem possible. Right?)
Why does Joe keep torturing us. Time to go Joe. Sorry.
I must say I have to hand it to all those who are calling for Biden to step down. Your pathetic attempts to try and bully him off the ticket are actually making me feel sorry for him. And you're seriously starting to piss me and a lot of other people (of what I can read in online comment sections and Twitter) off.
The people who are agitating for his removal are good writers and thinkers for the most part and I've like their stuff. But at some point there's a law of diminishing returns here and at some point you have to say "Well, I've said my piece and it's up to him because only he can make that decision." Instead what we're seeing here is magical thinking that one more article or more post will make the ultimate difference even when it is clear he's not going to change his mind. He said so in a letter, in speeches and in countless meetings with these different caucuses. Why is that not enough? Because these people think "Ahh, you're weak, I'm going to make you change your mind." They can't accept no for answer so their continue this utter nonsense of parsing every speech or every utterance for mistakes or pauses thinking somehow they're proving a point. They're not. They're just further dividing the party by angering people who feel 1). It is Joe's decision and not some pundit's and 2). The votes of 14 million Democrats who went to the polls this spring and the delegates he himself has earned through campaigning are not going to be invalidated because someone wrote a column for The Atlantic Sheesh! And you wonder why many people, not just Republicans, despise the media and all the so-called experts. It's not enough just to observe and comment or muse, by golly we gotta' make things happen! Then we can pat ourselves on the backs afterwards for drinks at The Monicle at how "influential" we are.
Yes people saw what they saw at the debate and they know Joe is old and has lost a step. No, they're not doubting what they saw. Yes, I would agree most Democrats think Biden should step down or at least wouldn't be opposed to it. And yet there are polls that actually show him ahead and the ones that do not, he's not that far behind. And that's the rub here and many of these pundits don't understand. Because if things were that bad, if Biden was behind by let's say 10-15 points, then I would agree with all this and I think nearly all Dems both the rank n' file and the politicians and elected officials would unanimously be demanding he step down to the point where his family (his real influencers, not you Mr. Pundit) would intervene to get him not just to step down as a candidate but as President himself. But that's not true! The polls are basically inconclusive at this point (which is surprising don't you think after all the flak received) but what they I think they do say is even though most Dems want him to step down, they'll still vote for him if he's the nominee!
So again, what incentive is there for him to step down, hmm? There's nothing! You want him to resign and leave the White House altogether even though he has the votes at the convention, he's still competitive in the polls and he feel confident he can win and run a "fighting" campaign unlike a lot of other "defeatist" Democrats because you especially think he ought to? Fuck you! What makes you so special, or so knowledgeable or so right? Hmm? Again, nothing! Be thankful you have a place to write or pontificate for a living or have the time and opportunity to do so because there's very little else that your opinion makes itself a weight of its own.
I said three weeks ago three things needed to happen all at once for him to step down: 1). his support cratered, funds dried up, and all Dem elected officials came together to demand it. That hasn't happened. Parts of it have happened but not so sufficient to force the question. And if it hasn't happened by now when is it going to happen? Hmm? And if it does happen, and Biden leaves, what's next? There are a sensible few who area ready to back Vice President Harris but a lot people know that so much of this agitation is the desire for an "open convention", again invaliding the results of the primaries because a certain few (and again it's always a few) don't like the results. I mean these people always they're concerned about and defending democracy and the first way they wish to do so is by denying a democratic outcome. Cute. And's not a coincidence that a certain number of these people (Ahem, ex-neocons!) tried to do the same thing eight years ago in the Republican Party when it was obvious Trump had the votes and the delegates to win the nomination and they still tried to scheme a way to stop him. Wisely that situation was avoided, because the worse outcome was not Trump winning but making the question of a primary election moot if the party's leaders and hacks were simply just going to change the rules anyway to get their desired outcome. And before anyone says anything, I'm not in favor out an early roll call because unlike some Democrats I'm confident still that he'll win it.
MAGA may well be a cult but one can appreciate the fact they're not going to upset the applecart because someone from the New York Times says they should. The bottom line is Republican voters have empowered Trump by their votes like it or not for the past decade because they support his policies and character and if you respect the democratic process then you have to respect their wishes, otherwise what's the point? Just because you don't like it? Fine, don't vote for it. Find a way to pursuade them otherwise (which DeSantis and Haley failed to do). Is that not true for the other side as well? Please explain to me why you think Democrats who voted for Biden should feel any different? Because they're Democrats? What kind explanation is that?
I think Biden should be like Sonny Corleone to Tom Hagen and say to the party "No! No more meetings, no more discussions, no more ways to try to patch things up. Just help me win!? That's his message in no uncertain terms and if the real "snowflakes" they are free to take their votes, their money and their support to other parties and campaigns and causes. But what they're not entitled to do (Ahem! Pelosi, Obama, celebrities, rich people) is to plot their way to upend a settled democratic process just because they don't like the outcome of it. That's what Trump tried to do in 2020. Because doing that is a much worse outcome for all involved then having the top of the ticket led by an old man even though many agree he's accomplished much.
Thank you
You're welcome.
Thank you spatrick. It's been an outrage how it's been going down.
You're welcome. As I said I was incline to say "Joe's Gotta Go!" after the debate but I also wanted to wait to see what the polling was so if it was that bad against Biden the case would be easier to make. And honest to God it isn't. I mean, the last thing I thought I'd see was a campaign rally showing people cheering "Joe Don't Go!"
I mean all of this is so fucking glib. Does Kevin and the rest realize what they're asking Joe to do is basically to be like Nixon and sulk back to Rehoboth Beach all for the want of a few polls, some of which he's leading or tied in? Do they not realize this? Joe does. He understands he can't make himself the ultimate lame duck for the next seven months (especially when they're trying to negotiate a ceasefire in the Middle East) and force Harris to answer questions as to whether he or she is in charge. So it is about stepping down as President, okay? That's internal logic of it and that's why this pathetic effort will fail, because no one in the Biden family is prepared to just quit and walk away from the White House for purely political reasoning, let alone to try an avoid impeachment ala Nixon. It would not enhance his legacy despite what they mistakenly believe, it would be devastating to it. Trump would never entertain these kind of thoughts no matter how bad a shape he was in (well, for obvious reasons) and certainly Clinton did not. But somehow we expect Biden to like some Tory politician. As the Queen well put it "A confederacy of elected quitters." I hope Biden is not that.
By the way for all you polling fanatics, of the last five national polls done before yesterday, according to the 538 website, the biggest Trump lead nationally is by a point. A single freaking point!
"Oh Joe please step down, you're going to lose"!
I mean, I'm hearing all this crap about "internal." polls the Dems are doing showing him getting killed and I'm just asking the question why this is not being reflected in the public polling, especially since the "devastating" debate was three weeks ago?
"Oh Trump was almost assassinated, people feel sorry for him now, he'll get a convention bounce..."
Maybe, I don't know. But if one thought Biden would have no chance after the debate, please tell me why the current polling doesn't say that.
Also remember this, Humphrey was 15 points behind Nixon after the 1968 DNC and almost won. Ford was behind Carter by 39(!) points in '76 and almost won. Bush rallied from an 18-point deficit in 1988 and no one was calling for him to step down and he won easily. Biden's down one and some people want him not just to be the nominee but resign the Presidency itself! What the fuck is going on here?
Those wanting Biden to step down need to present a medical argument for his departure, that he can't hold up for another four years. Some have but almost all those wanting Biden to go have presented political arguments that just don't hold up and that history says are just plain daffy.
> "By the way for all you polling fanatics, of the last five national polls done before yesterday, according to the 538 website, the biggest Trump lead nationally is by a point. A single freaking point!"
Most EC analysis that I've read suggests that to win, Biden needs to by at leasr 3-4% in the popular vote.
This is all very eloquent but it flatly ignores the institutional pressures against prominent Democrats running against an incumbent Democratic President. Biden cleaned up in the primaries because he had no real opposition. He had no opposition because no senior members of the party wanted a repeat of 1980 when Ted Kennedy destroyed Jimmy Carter's already fairly slim chance of re-election.
Yes, the party elders can rightly be criticized for "missing" or more likely, willfully ignoring, the signs of decline in the President. But it was a widely agreed fact that he had done a bang-up job getting a reasonable plan passed through a narrow House, so why fix what appeared not to be broken?
+1
But I wouldn't put much weight on polls in July. If you don't believe me, ask President Dukakis.
He needs to face up to facts and resign the presidency before it's too late.
I note with approval Kevin believes Biden should resign from the presidency and not just the campaign. Quite so. Quite apart from the awkwardness of having a man too old to run against Trump be in charge of the country, his remaining in office after quitting the race will muddy the waters of Kamala Harris. From the perspective of politics, the cleaner the break, the better.
In might make sense for him to step down after the convention, though, just to be sure it is indeed Harris and not someone else. In the event the convention chooses a Beshear or a Kelly or a Pritzker or a Whitmer, it might be better for Joe to stay on until January (this looks super unlikely to me, but best to be certain).
I do like the sounds of Harris-Whitmer. I'd imagine Harris will choose a male running mate, but a two-woman ticket would be one hell of an audacious way to reset the contours of this race. And Whitmer is fantastic:
https://x.com/Acyn/status/1811221353758126281
I defy any of you Biden dead-enders to look at this clip and not get excited at the prospect of this women eviscerating JD Vance on reproductive rights.
Know hope.
I defy any of you Biden dead-enders
Let's not eat our own, here--essentially whoever is on the D ticket in November, we all need to support that, and stirrring up anger now isn't going to serve us well on that main fight.
I'm doing everything in my power to support a Dem victory and Trump defeat; I imagine you are, too. This is far from an ideal situation; even if Biden gracefully steps aside (perhaps citing a doctor's note?), the result is still a mess. If nothing else, consider how much having the candidate *not* being the one from the primaries defangs arguments that Trump is the one who is undemocratic . . .
It is what it is, but we're going to need to rally ourselves all together to prevail, so I'd urge everybody to remember that we're all on the same side.
Fair enough. But like Jasper I think our best chance of winning in November is for Joe to step aside. I don't say this lightly. Though I thought he should not have chosen to run for re-election I also thought he could win. Despite the lies and bullshit coming from the monster from Queens and the cowardly remains of the "responsible" GOP , Joes' record is a very good one but as time has worn on it has become clear that he cannot seem to defend it because of his age and whatever cognitive decline has set in (and please don't tell me you don't see it). A good candidate could run on Joe's record and the show the way forward. Imagine someone like Bill Clinton swatting away the bullshit. And I think Harris and whoever ran with her (Whitmer is not a bad choice) could do just that.
Run on the great success of the past 4 years and turn the narrative back to the idiotic plans of MAGAman and company instead of Joe's latest fumble which are going to continue.
All that said, if because of vanity and ego - and that's what it is - Biden will not graciously step aside then I will campaign vigourously for him and do my best to forget about all my reservations, but when he probably loses I will also blame him.
I'm not saying I disagree. Just urging folks to keep in mind:
a) the situation is a mess,
b) it is vital that Trump be repudiated in November, and
c) the common thread of every potential winning path forward is lefties of all stripes pulling together, and pulling hard.
If Joe steps down/aside, I'll commend him for his service, and work like hell to get the successor candidate elected. If Joe doesn't step down/aside, I'll still commend him for his service, and work like hell to get him reelected. I hope everybody else does so, too.
+1
Agreed, but....if we succeed we almost guarantee a 25th Amendment removal within a year or eighteen months.
"we almost guarantee a 25th Amendment removal within a year or eighteen months."
Which would still be better than Trump.
yup.
???? Nothing matters but making sure the orange menace doesn't get anywhere near the white house ever again. Whoever that ends up being.
Let's not eat our own, here--essentially whoever is on the D ticket in November
Fair point. And I meant no offense. I've said it before and I'll say it again: President Biden has done an excellent job, and I'll crawl over glass to vote for him if he's the alternative to Trump.
I simply think a Trump restoration will be a disaster for America, and therefore Democrats should maximize their chances of prevailing. In my view (and very clearly in the view of many senior Democrats who do politics for a living), a new, younger ticket is how to maximize the probability of victory.
I defy you to answer how Biden's answers during the debate were incoherent. I posted the full transcript (not cherry picked single lines like Kevin did) of the first few answers he gave, which people like you and Kevin thought were incoherent despite them being coherent and detail filled answers to the question asked, or a Trump response, yet all I got were crickets. Care to answer now?
Here is the original article with the comments if your memory needs a refresher
https://jabberwocking.com/theres-no-embarrassment-in-getting-something-wrong/comment-page-1/#comments
Unfortunately, voters don't make their choices by carefully analyzing a transcript.
harris & ks governor laura kelly. former republican & governor of the state that threw out the republican push to amend state constitution to outlaw abortion.
gets you some nikki haley stans ((ex) gop on a unity ticket) & dobbs election believers.
The convention would not choose anyone who isn't Kamala Harris, unless she suddenly started wearing red baseball caps.
So, three questions for Kevin:
1. I still haven't read any stories talking about sharing campaign funds. If Biden can only share his war chest with the new candidate if he first accepts the nomination as Biden-Harris and THEN bows out and hands the whole thing to Harris, wouldn't it make sense for him to do nothing yet, even if he's already decided to step down (and why decide now when you have time)?
2. Biden's a danger now? Because he doesn't have every number available in his head? Do you think Bush 2 did? Or even Obama? The point of having it written down is to get it right; what's not clear (unless you saw the teleprompter) is whether he misread or there was a typo in the prompter. (Ron Johnson just "typoed" a whole speech, according to him.) You really think he'd look better if he'd stopped after reading the 55 and said, "no, it's 5%"? What specific thing has Biden himself or his administration done since the debate (or at all, this year) that proves he's incapable of doing the job with support (and all presidents need support)?
3. You advocate Biden resigning as president and think, I assume, that Harris should run.
In other words, you expect Harris to become PotUS, learn the job, and do the job while at the same time campaigning for president (which she has never done as the candidate). This when it appears Biden is at least capable of holding the office for the next six months.
Again, not one word of this conversation has to do with policies or actual achievements. Democrats should be running and winning on those things, but lose a lot of the time when it comes down to "Reality TV" elections between two people and "who would you have a beer with" or similar meaningless things.
Trump thinking almost immediately after being grazed by a bullet that "this will make a great photo opportunity" is admirable, if that's the kind of political thinker you are. Given that he doesn't have to run based on his positions, his platform, or even his past achievements, no wonder.
I don't think democrats can spin it to win it at this point. He should gather up his dignity and step aside, difficult as that may be. I write that as one who likes Biden and appreciates what he has done. It sucks to see but I believe my lying eyes.
Good god man you've swallowed all the disinfo whole, this is simply the Buttery E-mails of this election cycle. Joe is Joe he's always ever had the stutter that makes you more prone to speaking cautiously slowly and substituting words for ones you can pronounce without stuttering so sometimes you replace wrong on the fly.
This is just about as bad as the idiots I knew in college that wanted a nuclear freeze but ignoring the fact that the movement was a Soviet backed project.
I don't think this is just about the stutter but in a sense it doesn't matter what I think. The American voter -= way too many and not just the MAGAnauts - have been telling us for while that they don't think Biden can do the job any more and that has been showing up in the polls all along and we just ignroed it. Biden should be beating Trump handily . He's an incumbent, our economy is in remarkabvly good shape ( a case Biden just doesn't make very well over and over again), most Americans support our efforts to stop Putin in Ukraine and Biden's success at leading the way with NATO. Immigration is a problem but a better candidate could just point to the bill Trump made sure his party killed and show what a fraud Trump is on this.
But other than immigration what we're seeing is that too many people think Biden is too old.
"Biden should be beating Trump handily "
See, this is the real problem in my opinion. Because a lot of liberals believe this.
The reality is we have a divided, polarized nation and in that nation there exists and has exists an anti-liberal faction that under different guises over the years but nevertheless is a significant part of the U.S. population.
The one thing I've learned from reading Rick Pearlstein's books is that attempts by those, especially those left-of-center, to say that we're all one big happy unfied family and that our differences are superficial and can be worked out is that they're full of shit.
Partisan, ideological factions aren't very large or certainly not a majority but they don't have to be. They simply have to take control of one of the major parties or both. And when they do (which is the case in the GOP with the illiberal faction) those in that party who are not ideological but just merely political have a choice, they can support the party and candidates or not and face the consequences.
And in this case, a majority of those who are anti-Trump (even if they don't publicly admit it) are supporting him because if they wish to stay in that party and be a candidate in the future they have no choice. Either that or switch parties. Most people choose or in this case have chosen except for a handful to stay put (exceptions being Goldwater '64 or McGovern '72).
And so long as that faction controls the whole party, regardless whether you think "Biden should be winning by a lot" he's not going to be and it's not because he's running a bad campaign, it's because we have an evenly divided party system right now and those parties take an even share of the vote with only a faction of the vote left to fight over.
So please stop thinking Biden should be way out in front or any other Dem for that matter. If 2020 didn't rid of that fallacy, I don't know what will.
Trump has complete controll over the GOP. It ceased to be a political party and has morphed into a cult like entity if not one outright. It's scarey what I hear Trump supporters say. downright frightening actually.
Trump got 46% of the vote in 2016 and 2020 (actually a little more in 2020) . I think that is close to the MAGA ceiling. The key is that in 2020 Biden got over 7 million more votes or over 51%. What has happened in the past 4 years to make Trump more popular ? January 6th ? Becoming a convicted felon ? Sure the MAGAnauts don't care but they are still not a majority. No, when I look at this race the one Achilles heel we have seems to me, over and over again, to be Biden's age and the way it is manifested in his mostly weak public performances. Sure the Joe of 2020 would win this election by more than 7 million votes. But he has aged very badly in the past 6 months to a year and everyone sees it, most certainly the orange monster from Queens who has a very shrewd reptile brain for this stuff.
These kind of unsupported, wild guesses are easy to make, but its silly to charge forward with a wild guess.
Trumps advanced age plus similar similar elderly moments along with scores of senators who win at advanced ages should make you doubt how important this is.
Just because the Trump campaign has been pushing this narrative for many, many months doesnt mean we should accept it as common sense.
It's interesting to compare this post to the previous 3.
* Biden admin obeys the law and Republicans don't
* Stock market is doing very well
* Earnings up for men
* And the man responsible for all this has to go!
I mean I do wish Biden didn't seem so old but what exactly is the problem here?
the problem is the administration has a pretty good record and biden's had 4 years to sell it to the voters but he's taking a beating in the swing states
so the people who say 'show me' wrt a new candidate need to 'show me' how biden will accomplish in these last few weeks what he's failed to do over the last 4 years
He will have failed to do it if and when he loses not before. Let's wait for the final outcome, okay?
well, that certainly seems to be trump's preference
Or we could actually address the issue while there's still time to do something about it.
So the issue is not that he's having mental lapses but that he might lose the election?
both
Yes. There is a lot of magical thinking going on with the 'dump Joe' crowd.
Trump and the media are pushing this narrative and gullible dems are soaking it up.
Issue is not whether Joe had 4 good years. It’s whether he would have 4 more. One thing that has bothered me about Joe recently is too much focus on the past , not enough on the future. Also, he has at times talked as if the point of the election is to ensure his place in history, not to serve the American people. I know you have to have a healthy ego just to run for prez, but I’ve been shocked at how much Biden has made this about his personal legacy rather than the nation.
Exactly. If he's re-elected there will be a 25th Amendment removal well within two years. He is disintegrating before the nation's eyes.
And it's sad, because he has the best "character" of any President since Jimmy Carter. Bush I came close, but he had drunk the Libertarian Kool-Ade a bit too often to really listen to his inner guidance fully, which was, like Joe's, excellent.
Son of a gun, I agree. Daddy Bush was a Republican I thought I might vote for in 1980 until he caved in to Reagan’s nonsense when he was chosen as vp. (I realize that is part of the gig of being vp.)
+1
There's no problem with his record. No reasonable person denies he's been a great president. The problem is he's losing.
Its like being on the Titanic, except this time it's making a slow but inevitable path straight into the iceberg. I really don't think I have every felt this unenthusiastic about my presidential candidate or their chances of wining, and I cast my first vote for Jimmy Carter.
Don't know if Harris or anyone else can win, but the Democratic party needs a major shake up, if only not to get completely shellacked down ticket.
If Biden does drop out he certainly should not resign, but simply say he is uncertain about his capability to be effective for the next 4 years.
This. It's dignified, wise and honest.
As a republican who wants anyone other than Trump to be elected, I completely agree with Kevin. Unless something drastic happens, Biden is not going to win. Dems need to keep the pressure on him to step down with dignity so you can nominate someone that can beat Trump. (And I don't think Harris is the best choice for that.)
Given all that's happened to find Biden only a point in the polling should be concerning to you. Why aren't you asking Trump to step down?
you have a poll where he's down by one in all of the swing states?
otoh, republicans are excited to vote for trump and he leads in the swing states; why would he leave?
Dude, Biden has MILLIONS of "excess votes" in the West Coast states. The "voting efficiency" of Democrats is relatively poor, though breaking some of the Gerrymanders recently has improved it for the House. For President, though, all those Senatorial electors in BumFuck, Dakota make a big difference. A Democrat has to win by at least 4% to carry the EC. Trump won the Presidency against Clinton by carrying MiWiPa by a total of a bit more than 100K votes. Biden will get forty times that many more than needed in California.
That’s silly. Trump is not going to step down (obviously). The dem candidate needs to beat him otherwise he will be president again.
He can't legally be president, but that won't stop him.
Well, it's either Biden or Harris, it's extremely, extremely unlikely that anything else will happen.
Why does it have to be Harris?
It doesn't *have* to be. I'm very much afraid that it *will* be, because turning the whole shebang over to Harris is the easy way out. The alternative is to select a new candidate at the convention, and that comes with a whole lot of unknowns: Will the delegates pick a strong candidate or do something nutty? If they don't pick Harris, will that alienate her supporters to the point of sitting out the election? Will the newly chosen candidate be capable of taking the reins and competing in a national campaign with almost no warning?
Personally, I think Harris's negatives (compared to candidates like Shapiro and Whitmer) are serious enough to justify taking those risks. But I worry that Democratic leaders, after going through the fight to push out Biden, will have no stomach for taking on Harris as well.
People voting for trump don’t think he’s going to put anything at risk. The economy will get better. Inflation will disappear. Prices for food and stuff they need will actually drop! Immigrants will disappear without affecting the availability of services. Transgender and gay folks will go straight and become Christians again. Our enemies will become our friends and we can ignore our old useless allies. There will be peace, prosperity, and goodness all over the country.
And resistance is futile. ????
trump will also be selling indulgences; $499.99 gets you a lakefront property with a view of the pearly gates or you money back!
Exactly
In public, Biden has turned into a scatterbrained, bumbling old fool. He can't complete a train of thought and what does come out is often gibberish, misspeak, or the talking points his staff has fed him. He's counting on Democratic voters sticking with him because they despise Trump. It won't work. Voters are already turning away from Biden, and when the ad campaigns start ramping up, everyone will see what Biden has become. It's time to get somebody new, and fast. Even though I think Kamala Harris is prone to windy platitudes and word salads, I'll take a Harris/Newsom ticket any day. Biden is a dead end.
Newsom is an electoral dead end too, and you can't have both candidates on the ticket be from California, for both technical legal reasons, and because politically it would be extremely stupid.
I don't know why you think Newsom is a dead end. He's been one of Biden's most ardent and effective surrogates. As far as where a candidate is "from", the applicable language in the 12th amendment refers to "residency". Harris currently resides in Washington DC. Finally, I don't think voters are as hung up on where a candidate is from as you seem to think, and I don't think Biden chose Harris to be his running mate because he was afraid of losing California.
There's a question about exactly where the residents of the White House and Naval Observatory actually "live". They certainly don't "own" their homes nor do they pay rent. They are where they are at the suffrance of the voters of the United States. Presumably, then, they still "live" in whichever state they resided at their election.
If that's true, then Ms. Harris and Mr. Newsom cannot both receive Electoral Votes from California electors. Presumably they would vote for Ms. Harris, because that's the important job. But she might end up with J.D. Vance as her subaltern if the Harris-Newsom ticket didn't win by enough that California's votes were not needed.
That's quite unlikely.
Gov. French Laundry. Not going to play in Scranton. No thanks.
The Republican line of attack on Harris, if she's the nominee, will be to make her out a crazy California uber-liberal. All constitutional questions aside, putting another California pol on the ticket would play right into Trump's hands.
On top of that, while the "home state" impact of veep picks is probably overrated, it's not nothing, and we've seen more than one election decided by razor-thin margins in swing states. Harris would be much better served by Shapiro (Pennsylvania), Whitmer (Michigan), or someone from Georgia, Wisconsin, or North Carolina.
I mean, it's hilarious that I've been able to make "That Thing You're Worried About Isn't a Big Deal to Kevin Drum" into a thing, because he's so blithely indifferent to so many things that don't affect him personally, and then he goes absolutely apeshit about this. Yeah, in retrospect he should have decided to not run, a year and a half ago. Given the current situation maybe he should drop out and maybe he shouldn't, it's still arguable which is more likely to result in defeating Trump. But calling for his resignation is silly, irrational, and defeatist. It's probably the dumbest position I've ever seen Drum take.
nytimes:
The person on the call singled out some of the searches on one of the gunman's cellphones — the device he left in his residence — saying that he had looked up “major depressive disorder.”
If he wanted to commit suicide by cop he could have chosen a less fraught vehicle by which to attract the cop's attention. Jes' sayin'
he was a hunter; maybe he just wanted to see if he could evade the cops long enough to do it
given the previous reputation of the secret service, i'm guessing he was surprised he got as far as he did
Thanks to the Yen-USD valuation, it's relatively affordable to purchase an empty house or an empty plot in Japan, go back to basics and restart life as a modest farmer. That's my alternative escape plan if this all goes down the shitter. Don't get me wrong, Canada's an awesome country especially the coasts, but the valuation just isn't loonie enough.
Excellent pun, there, D_Ohrk_E1.
To the topic of the post, I'm wondering how exactly the President of the United States can impose Rent Control on the entire country. Seems a bit of a stretch.
article 2, per the current iteration of the supremes.
Aside from all of this, it has just been announced that Joe Biden has tested positive for COVID. Sigh.
I ask in all seriousness: what does this accomplish?
"He needs to face up to facts and resign the presidency before it's too late."
I am not joking. I am requesting responses. I'd love it if Kevin himself could hop on here and explain it to me, because I'm serious. This makes no sense to me. What does that statement accomplish? What's the damn point?
Biden's not going to step aside from the race or resign the Presidency. Let's leave aside the question about what sort of election chaos would ensue if he did. Let's just focus on reality: Biden is not going anywhere. He's made that clear since his rally a day after the first debate. And he pointed out in his interview with Lester Holt that he's done two dozen public events since then with tens of thousands of attendees (I am repeating my best recollection of his assertion).
So: what is the point of asking him to step down?
Imagine that you're in a race and you twist your ankle. The race continues, but you come to a complete stop, stare at your ankle and say, "transform right now into a healed ankle so that I can win this race." Then you stand there waiting for your ankle to obey. Meanwhile, your opponent (who faces his own handicaps) continues his own best attempt to hobble across the finish line.
What should you do in that scenario? Get back in the f*#king race you idiot! Your ankle has made it clear that you're stuck with it, so the gobsmackingly obvious thing to do is to just keep going.
One thing that has become more clear to me now than at any time in my life is that Democrats are not necessarily smarter than Republicans. I grew up with the assumption that they (and - by extension - me) were. But it's not so.
Sure, Democrats may on average be a well-educated group. We may occupy a lot of "elite" spaces (especially in fields like journalism, academia, entertainment, and publishing). But IQ and education obviously aren't everything.
Republicans have an intelligence of their own. Don't get me wrong, they lose a lot. But at least they consistently put up a good fight. They are tough. And that sort of determination does in fact involve an important mental fortitude.
Democrats also win a lot (as recently as 2020 we had full control of the Federal government - and we put it to fairly good use). But they do not seem to handle setbacks well. They panic. They snivel. And they whine.
They issue nonsensical demands that their twisted ankle must immediately (and more or less magically) transform into a healed ankle, otherwise they will just keep pouting instead of finishing the race.
And that's what I just don't get it. Explain it to me. What is the actual purpose of Kevin's statement asking Biden to resign? Why demand that that the sun set in the east? Why ask the sky to turn green? Why keep pouting because reality refuses to conform to your demands? What.is.the.damn.point?
They are tough
yup, a lot of americans love tough guys
when 50 million people watched that debate, biden didn't look like a tough guy
@lower-case:
"when 50 million people watched that debate, biden didn't look like a tough guy"
The metaphorical ankle in my post (above) is indeed injured. My point is that there's no purpose served by staring at it and demanding that it instantly and magically transform into a healed ankle. It's.not.going.anywhere. It's our ankle. It's attached to us. We're stuck with it.
So let's finish the race with it as best we can. I personally cannot see any other reality-based solution.
And that's why I keep asking: what is the point of non-reality-based demands?
it ain't over until the convention delegates cast their votes
even then, if biden resigns, has a stroke, or is otherwise incapacitated, he can be replaced
@lower-case
You're in denial. Get over yourself.
From the BBC -
US President Joe Biden has said only the "Lord Almighty" could convince him to end his bid for re-election ...
"I have a cognitive test every single day. Every day I have that test - everything I do [is a test]," he told George Stephanopoulos -
You, apparently, are the idiot in my metaphor yelling at your sprained ankle to instantly transform into a different ankle so that you can finish the race.
I just have no words in the face of such immaturity, denial, petulance, and whining. Get a grip. We have an election to win. Biden will be the nominee. And it just doesn't matter if you approve of that situation or not.
people say lots of things, even you
doesn't mean i have to believe them
We have an election to win.
Yes. Let's field the most competitive ticket we can.
Biden will be the nominee
Looking doubtful.
“If Biden wants to withdraw under the DNC rules, that’s fine — 33 states defer to DNC rules on substitution and nomination,” Matheu said. “It probably would be a nothingburger in those states.”
“But there are other states, like Wisconsin, that have mental incapacity issues that have to be essentially asserted to the Secretary of State to say, ‘Hey, here’s why this candidate is no longer going to be the nominee,’” he said.
That would bring up 25th Amendment issues about Biden continuing to serve as president, he said.
Should Biden withdraw as the candidate after state deadlines have passed and after ballots are printed, Matheu said, there would very likely be lawsuits filed in state and federal courts.
“The reason why this is all kind of a patchwork, and there’s a lot of confusion, even among the experts, is that it’s 50 different states,” Matheu said. “So it’s not going to be a clear-cut issue one way or the other.”
The possibility of swapping another candidate in for Biden gets much more complicated the closer the country gets to election day, he said.
“I think that’s why there’s so much interest right now in whether or not he’s going to pull out earlier rather than later,” Matheu said. “Because it’s much easier for him to do it now.”
https://azmirror.com/2024/07/17/if-a-presidential-nominee-drops-out-what-happens-to-states-ballots/
J. D. Vance outright refuses to debate Kamala Harris,
https://twitter.com/BidenHQ/status/1813714082496758013/photo/1
Because she's a black woman, presumably, and that would make his audience feel like they weren't being respected.
And also because he'd piss himself.
probably doesnt want to risk being too shrill to an indo-american woman knowing he has to go home to one.
Biden tested positive for COVID again. It's time for Biden to quit the race.
Say all you want, but he's really trying his luck each time he gets sick. Every bout of Influenza in your 80s is a potential downward spiral. Every COVID infection is one more chance for Long-COVID to set in.
crossed my mind that he just wants to clear his calendar for discussions re his remaining in the race
According to Drumm, a President shouldn’t need a teleprompter to know his own policy. Under that standard, both Biden and Trump should step aside.
As Drum wrote on March 12, 2020, when he was still at Mother Jones:
Drum concluded:
Would it really hurt Democrats who want Biden to step aside to say that neither Trump nor Biden are mentally up to the job of being President?
Trump people don’t care that he’s incompetent. They know it. They admit it. Don’t care.
I can’t recall any Trump supporters admitting that Trump is incompetent. I’ve read a lot of excuses for Trump from his supporters. Supposedly the Mueller investigation undermined Trump’s presidency. I’ve never seen anyone attempt to explain how. Supposedly the “deep state” blocked Trump. Curious how the “deep state” never blocked initiatives by other Presidents. The “deep state” was supposedly committed to keeping us in Afghanistan forever, but when Biden ordered the U.S. military to withdraw from Afghanistan, it did.
Trump supporters may know that Trump is incompetent and not care, but they keep up the pretense. Swing voters who get their news from CNN have been hearing lots of talk about Democrats questioning whether Biden is mentally competent, and zero about whether Trump is mentally competent. They are likely being mislead by this coverage because it creates the impression that nobody thinks Trump is mentally incompetent.
Four months from now, voters are almost certainly going to be choosing between Biden and Trump. My advice to Democrats is to assume that anything you put on the internet may be seen by a swing voter. If you are writing about an issue where you believe that Biden is bad and Trump is worse, say that. Don’t assume that “Trump is worse” goes without saying.
My fave recent printed example. Most of rest I’ve seen are tv interviews, like the big burly guy wearing a maga hat at trump rally who told a reporter “I wish he would just f****** shut up!”
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/republican-voting-couple-trump-cnn_n_661f7dfee4b0d633765822d9/amp
“”Trump’s moral character is “terrible,” Kay Swart admitted to (reporter Gary) Tuchman.
“It can’t get much lower than it is,” she added. “He continues to make crazy comments about being a dictator his first day and repercussions against people who he feels have wronged him.”
……
Tuchman asked the couple if Trump would be fit to become POTUS again if he is found guilty in one of his four criminal cases.
“I don’t think he’s fit,” replied Kay Swart, before adding: “But I’m voting for him.”
Ron Swart, meanwhile, claimed the United States wouldn’t survive four more years “of Democrats in charge.”
Trump is “most definitely” of low character, poor morals and poor ethics, he said. “I feel as wrong as it’s going to be to have him for president, he’s still going to be a lot better president for the United States than what we’ve gotten with Joe Biden and the Democrats,” he added.
Would it really hurt Democrats who want Biden to step aside to say that neither Trump nor Biden are mentally up to the job of being President?
Neither one should be in the White House given his brain age*. But only one is behind in six swing states; has been behind nationally for about half a year; and is wanted by the vast majority of his own party to bow out.
*Given his deep corruption, his catastrophic policy preferences, and his contempt for his own country, Trump isn't qualified to be president even if he had the brain of Young Sheldon. Biden is doing a perfectly fine job as chief executive (just not as Democratic nominee) and I'd be happy to see him go on indefinitely if I thought that were plausible. But unfortunately half the nation apparently thinks very differently.
ABC’s Jon Karl says Schumer told Biden it’s time to go.
The power of a good narrative and repetition is on full display.
While literally everyone mispeaks and literally nobody cares, when Biden does this, those under the spell of the 'Biden is old' narrative can only see it as more proof that Biden is too old. They demand to see Biden in public appearing coherent and speaking clearly, but when this occurs they brush it aside as it doesnt further their preferred narrative.
Very similar to the MAGA crowd enraptured by the 'Donald the savior' narrative. Anything counter to the narrative is discarded and literally everything is interpreted as further evidence of his greatness.
People are very malleable. Those who see themselves as completely immune to the drumbeat of the media and political messaging are the easiest targets.
The adult in the room appears to be Nancy Pelosi (again). Who has some credibility after retiring from leadership, if not from the House, with the words "The time has come for a new generation to lead", despite being cognitively very capable indeed. And though I joined the chorus calling for Biden to quit (but not resign from the presidency), I'm now more with the people who say chill it. Though more out of trust in Pelosi than in Biden.
If she gets Biden to quit, great, if she can't no one can, and either way she provides a way for Dems to unite. I'm usually all for cacophony from the base but the election is too close so I'd say let madam do it. The more since she's not a potential candidate, nor threatened in her own seat, but trusted to do what's good for the party as a whole.
Oh for f’s sake. A quick search on YouTube will provide ample examples of gaffes by Joe Biden, including one when he ran for President the first time where he flubbed numbers in his own policy ideas. It’s not the first time he’s done that. It’s only a problem now because you’re wanting to scrutinize every single word he says to push your latest wild ass hair. This isn’t lead levels or your latest lying chart about earned wages today that anyone can refute with a search on the Dept. of Commerce website. He’s the President and currently the only man standing in the way of fascist oblivion until/unless he steps aside and lets someone else run. He’s had a speech impediment his entire life, but now because of a bad debate you and everyone else attacks him like a bunch of rabid MAGA idiots.
Maybe we saw a different interview with Lester Holt. I saw Biden as angry with the news media and pundits like yourself and going after Holt for their abysmal coverage of the debate and everything since. What about coverage of Trump’s insane rant during the debate? What about his lies? We’re getting a reprieve now because of the assassination attempt, but it’s all circling back.