California law says that drivers have to retake the DMV test when they turn 70. Fine. But the test questions have become crazy. They're completely divorced from knowledge of meaningful traffic laws and instead focus on weird trivia. As a result, we've had an endless stream of 70-year-olds wailing about how they've failed the test two, three, four, a dozen times and are beside themselves with frustration. But our DMV director has finally taken action:
As for test questions, more than 20 have been removed from the rotation. One asked what a driver should do when seeing a road sign that says “NEV USE ONLY” or “NEV ROUTE.” Readers had complained to me that they didn’t know what NEV means (Neighborhood Electric Vehicle, or golf cart), or couldn’t imagine the issue comes into play often enough to waste space on a license renewal test.
Another question, now removed, had asked: “What is another name for the hand-to-hand steering method?” I’m still not sure why anyone would know or care. Also shredded was a question asking the minimum manslaughter sentence for killing someone while evading police pursuit, and another that asked what the punishment is if you “evade a law enforcement officer performing their duties, but no bodily injury occurs.”
I've heard examples even worse than these. Whose idea was this?
And the really crazy thing is that there's a little-known option for avoiding the whole mess: an eLearning test that you can take at home. If you get a question wrong you just try again. It's essentially impossible to fail.
Progress!
The interetsing question is how these question got in the test in the first place. I don't believe anybody that can write English believes that knowing the minimal sentence for killing someone would ever be useful for a driver, so I don't think plain incompetence can explain this.
It seems to me like the test version of filling dead air time.
Something not mentioned in the article: Is there a California State Driver's Manual that everybody is supposed to study that has all of the rules (I'm assuming that would be yes), AND - were the answers to the above questions in that manual (I'm assuming that would also be yes).
The answers are Yes and No respectively. There is a manual, but the answers to the above questions are not in there.
I'm currently preparing for the test because I am transferring an out-of-state license to CA, so the online testing option is not available to me. And I've found a number of questions whose content is not mentioned or covered in the CA Driver Handbook.
It's also frustratingly difficult to search the online handbook for specific information. It would be easier if it was downloadable as a single PDF, but instead it's spread out over half a dozen separate web pages, and whatever search capability the DMV web site provides is hopelessly inadequate.
Btw, there are many free online testing sites and they're easy to use. But don't trust all the answers they give. Some are contradictory and some are just buggy.
Correcting my own post. It *is* possible to download the entire handbook as a PDF (and I just did that).
It was a question always on the motorcycle test, and in the booklet.
Last time I failed knowing the difference between a trolly safety zone and a streetcar safety zone.
But I know the difference on the street: one is a slashed mark 'don't drive here' and the other is a hash mark for intersections that the cable car stops in and you just can't cross while the trolly is present.
I guess it's there because you want to educate the driver. They don't have to get that answer right; there are plenty of easy basic questions on the test for them to get right and make a passing score. But after being exposed to such a legal detail on their test, they'll be aware of something they might not have thought about before.
Standardized and qualifying tests really need to be reviewed periodically, at least every few years. Having a "diverse" reviewing body helps a lot, also.
Why is diverse in scare quotes?
I didn't mean to frighten you.
A written test for people who have had driver's licenses for many years seems pointless. The point of requiring retests for people of advanced age is to find out if their competence is slipping, and that takes a road test.
Agree about the road test, though it can be a very touchy thing to implement.
But doing a fresh written test makes some sense to me because laws and requirements can change. How cars are supposed to behave around bikes, for example, has probably seen some major changes in the past dozen years in most places, right on red was a really big-time change (when, the 80s?), and not so long ago we were newly required to have headlights on if the wipers are on. Stuff like that would be worth testing, imo, and I speak as one who hasn't done a rules-of-the-road test since I moved more than 30 years ago. But for sure not the kind of tangential crap KD cites.
1980. So, Thanks Jimmy 🙂
And jurisdictions may prohibit it where they wish - they simply must put-up signage at each intersection saying so.
In the words of Alvy Singer (note: Annie Hall came out in 1977):
I don't want to move to a city where the only cultural advantage is being able to make a right turn on a red light.
Not the best example of a cultural change, since CA was the earliest adopter in the US (1939 apparently).
As an aside, right-on-red wasn't national until the 80s, but it was legal in California when I learned to drive in the early 70s, and I believe long before that.
The rule is "test at age 70". Some other states have similar age related rules. If the concern was that laws and requirements have changed, it would make sense to retest everybody every decade or so. The focus on old people says that the concern is age related deterioration in driving ability, not failure to keep up with new rules.
Not so. A properly constructed written test screens for dementia. At 80, my mother was easily able to learn new facts about laws regarding drunk driving (0.08 vs 0.15, jail time for a first offense) but could not handle certain complicated questions due to her memory issues, and thus was kept from driving.
There are tests specifically designed for assessing cognitive impairment which would be much better for that purpose. Though I doubt there is much data relating dimensions of impairment to driving competence.
Now if they can get people to actually stop at stop signs...
And turn signals.
california roll
I remember something similar when I moved to Oklahoma in 1991 and had to take their written test. Half the questions were trivia questions, the sort of thing that tests your memorization ability and nothing else.
People don't realize that creating good tests is a skill, not a clerical task.
Creating good tests is a skill and most tests aren’t created by people with that skill. So, with multiple choice type tests, my go to method of answering if I don’t know the answer was always to choose the longest answer. Most people are lazy and why write out long answers if they aren’t correct? You might be surprised at how often that worked.
As for how the "NEV" question(s) might have come to be on the test, perhaps an older driver or two turned onto one of those by mistake in a retirement community...
But may car was registered in NEVada.
I figured I would have to take the driving test as I was 87. I went to the DMV site to study the written tests online. I found the learning test and passed with 100% first time. I had to go to the local DMV office to get my photo and finger print taken. No driving test required. I figure this will be my last license.
Congratulations on passing the test!
The only reason drivers over 70 don't kill many tens of thousands each year, is that they drive more slowly. Every 2 mph off your mean driving speed results in a dramatic reduction in injuries and deaths per mile driven.
Having watched my parents' driving before and after the 70 milestone, I believe I will sell my car on my 70th birthday. I don't want to hurt anyone.
Every human is different. Some are slipping and with vision problems at 60 or 70, some never.
My mother worried about that. From about age 80 onward, every time one of her five adult children visited her she would take them for a check ride. She said that if even one kid said she wasn't fit to drive any more, she would stop driving. (We "kids", I would note, all have decades each of accident free driving.)
She was driving her own car the day before she died at 93.
C'mon self driving cars!
I don’t see that in my community. Over 80 yes, but not over 70. I am 74 and non of my friends drive like that. It drives me nuts when people — usually much younger — crawl through the intersection on a protected left turn leaving 3-4 car lengths so only a few cars can get through. (( am not talking about those who are looking at their phones and miss the change of the light. I am talking about people who start in a reasonable time but then drive really, really slowly. Some of them are the same people who tailgate at regular speed. I know because one intersection where this is common is right before you get to my neighborhood.
Oh, come on now! Isn't it obvious? This is a weedout
classtest. I'd wager this implenatation was designed to get the "you'll get my keys when you pry them out of my cold, dead hands" driver.Ya I wouldn't know the answers to any of those questions, and doubt any age group would. Nothing like that was in the test booklet you had to study when I got my license back in 80s. The only thing you really worried about was not missing blind intersection and getting 3-point turn right.
I got rear ended by an old today while I was at a stop sign. Get them the fuck off the road.
Makes sense to me.
I got sideswiped by a middle-aged white guy last week. Get them the fuck off the road, too!
Hi thersites, nice to see you here again!
Agreed, especially if they drive a nice car. Those frickers are always entitled assholes.
Are the questions in the test they give applicants for new licences? If so, they need to be removed from them too.
In Queensland the only age-related requirement is to have an annual medical examination after turning 75. .
Driving tests, written or performance-based, should be an assessment of the applicant’s competence to operate a motor vehicle safely. There should be ongoing evaluation of test elements based on subsequent history of violations and accidents. I doubt that memorization skills play much of a role beyond recognition of traffic signs. Beyond perceptual, attentional and control skills, safety behavior should be assessed — maintaining situational awareness, signaling intentions and the like. I would think a performance test, which could be done in simulation, would be best for these purposes.
Driving simulators exist, but the good ones are very expensive, which is why real world road tests are still the standard.
Redbird brought the price of flight simulators down dramatically by designing for manufacturing in volume: https://simulators.redbirdflight.com/products
There are many more driving schools and DMV offices than there are flight schools; venture capitalists, take notice.
Seems weird that you would let drivers go a half century (16-18 to 69) then retest them on their 70th birthday to see whether they’ve kept up on changes to driving laws during that time. If they haven’t, you’ve already let them drive for 50+ years on false knowledge! Just test their eye sight and cognition like other states do, and be done with it if they haven’t gotten any tickets or points in the meantime.
Things that always confuse me are the questions on how many feet before the corner do you need to put on your turn signal and how many feet does it take to stop when you're going x mph? I have a sense for the distances involved, and I'm pretty conservative about my estimates when driving -- and also not good at all at estimating "feet" (or even metres.)
Thus, when it's time to renew my license (assuming I live so long), I'd be smart to review the online manual.
The rules currently say that if there's a bike lane and you want to make a right turn you have to enter the bike lane 200 feet in advance and then signal 100 feet in advance. Apart from being able to estimate the distances, this is somewhat absurd because when you enter the bike lane at 200 feet you presumably need to signal, so why be told to signal again at 100 feet (unless you turn off your first signal, but then nobody will know why you're in the bike lane and not planning to turn). I guess the 100 feet applies when there's no bike lane involved.
The rules say 'you may' enter, not 'have to' and if you entered the bike lane without signaling, you've violated the law by changing lanes without signaling.
So what you're saying is that you can legally enter the bike lane 100 feet before the turn and signal (for both reasons) there? Good thing there was no question to trip me up on that point (not in the sample permit tests, anyway).
I took the California test back in the Carter administration. My recollection was that it was a test of having the common sense to know what the intended correct answer was. I don't recall feeling any need to study the manual. It appears that a bunch of filler was added over the ensuing decades.
Um... I've been 70. In fact, I've been (and currently am) 71. And I live in California. I've not retaken the DMV test, nor have I been asked to. Should I be looking over my shoulder for rogue DMV agents?
You don't retake it until you renew.
The biggest problem with the new questions was that they weren't in the pratice tests or the driver's handbook.
Why were they putting in new law questions into the test before it was in the handbook (if at all?)
This hand placement business is mostly about what happens when an airbag pops. But if you are over 70, it's likely your car is so old that it doesn't have an airbag.
The hand question is on the order of, :"If you are playing Taylor Swift really loud on the radio, what adjustments should you make while driving?"
The law enforcement questions are silly. It's okay to ask what new driving/parking laws have been enacted. It's ridiculous to ask process questions. That has no relevance to driving safety.
Answer to the Taylor Swift question:
Change the channel to a sports radio station to find out the latest news about Travis Kelce.