Just for the record, everyone understands that Tucker Carlson couldn't care less about Hungary, right? Nor does he care about the policies of its quasi-autocratic prime minister, Viktor Orbán. And of course, neither does his audience, very few of whom have even heard of Orbán before this week.
Tucker's weeklong lovefest in Budapest is solely a dumber than usual effort to annoy liberals and prompt them to write earnest thumbsuckers about the conservative love for authoritarians. So how about if we don't do it? There's no chance that Hungary will become a model for the US, so we can safely ignore Carlson's latest stunt.
Republicans already have their own model to get to where Hungary is, but if you think the US can't become as authoritarian as Hungary or that republican thought leaders aren't priming the base for it, you are dead wrong.
Yes, obviously the fact that right-wing ideological radicals have not been trying to export their brand of neo-fascism and religious oppression around the world, is not news worthy, is it?
The GOP and American Evangelicals, in fact, may be the only Fascist organizations that actually do operate globally. As was on public display during the Trump administration.
Fascists come to power using two tools:
1. Exploit the tools of democracy to the utmost to grab power
2. Rely on well meaning liberals who don't take them seriously.
Your number 2, AMEN.
I thought we’re supposed to be attacking and shaming Fox as much as possible. I’m getting confused.
If Tucker sees his future in Hungary and moves there, good for us. I say launch a “Rich Preppies for Orban” group and let Tucker run it.
Yes, I suppose it's true that this is just a small step toward authoritarianism, and that this alone won't get us there. And yet I'm still against small steps toward authoritarianism.
"There's no chance that Hungary will become a model for the US, so we can safely ignore Carlson's latest stunt."
Did you overdose on happy pills this morning, Kevin?
Sorry Kevin but a significant chunk of elites on the Right see Orban as the future that could work. Besides Carlson, Dennis Prager is presenting at the fascistopalozza and Rod Dreher has been a fellow at some revanchist think tank in Budapest. Much of the current Republican slo-mo coup is modeled on Orban's turning Hungary into an illiberal Democracy. Their efforts may not work but not taking them seriously is a mistake.
"Blood and soil" nationalism would appear to be ascendant in GOP policy-circles. Stephen Miller and Steve Bannon certainly espoused it. I'd guess Tom Cotton, does, too.
Kevin's in denial.
Hawley-Gabbard 2024: America is Hungary for Change.
You constantly work to deemphasize the threats to American democracy. It's as though you actually buy into American Exceptionalism.
The institutions are only as strong as the people who work in them.
On the other hand, it's not clear that the 20-30% of the population that would actually be OK with legislatures overturning election results have enough grit/suck to do it or make it stick if they try. The far right is pretty despondent over their civil war not happening [yet] and they're slowly discrediting themselves to their conservative-but-not-crazy neighbors what with the anti-vaxx stupidity and "prophecies" of Trump's return and whatnot.
At this point, maintaining a general atmosphere of "you guys dumb" is our best defense against righties doing dumb stuff. I think this is implicitly Kevin's approach.
I want to believe you, but that 36% of the population / 67% of Republicans who think the election was stolen and Trump should be restored by any means necessary is enduring. And the other 33% of Republicans don't really care bout the end of American democracy so long as they regain power and control the government.
nope. it's about appealing to tucker's authoritarian, racist, nationalist, asshole viewers. and probably about building a personal relationship with a powerful, wealthy, head of state.
I was wondering what happened to Joseph Mifsud.
Maybe he absconded from Rome to Budapest...
I dunno. I learned / refreshed a lot of the history and wider context of the subject in Yglesias's piece on the topic today: https://www.slowboring.com/p/hungarian-nationalism-is-not-the. Not scary or utterly superfluous. Kind of interesting.
I can always rely on him to be a fool and he doesn't disappoint here either.
It's getting to be clear we can always rely on you to be an ass and you don't disappoint here either.
I was not familiar with this author until just now, he does a very good job of speaking in normal language, He does his work by dressing up his favorite generalities, for example when he's holding up Big Tech as an accomplishment, I think of the destruction of customer service, the destruction of many people's ability to be grounded by dawn to bod cell phone culture, and the creation of the most useless insanely wealthy elite ever known to mankind, the Venture Capital bros.
Nevertheless, I have to admit Big Tech some kind of a major global accomplishment, and the tale he weaves from his generalities is a pretty positive one, not disconnected from reality and conveyed in a form that should be useful for Democrats seeking centrist voters. And I think he'd agree with most of us vs. Ken, that it is worthwhile spending some energy calling out the stupidity of the "intellectual" right's embrace of Hungary.
Trying to move too fast, Kevin, of course, not Ken, and there was a paragraph inserted in the middle there, but the layout shifts between draft and post and I will try to keep putting in an extra blank line, as I know my prose tends to be thick.
This is Kevin in both his contrarian and Dr. Pangloss modes. Frankly, this piece is both infuriating and dead wrong. The almost openly fascist Republican Party and its supporters see Hungary as a model for the (very) near future US--a racist and anti-Semitic white, Christian authoritarian right wing government with the trapping of democracy but rigged machinery that ensure the controlling party always wins. And it got there the old fashioned way--gerrymandering, a stacked judiciary, controlled media, and a corrupt system that rewarded its corporate friends and punished its enemies. So yes Kevin, this is absolutely newsworthy. But you are free to stubbornly ignore it.
I think the weather's just too nice in California. You need to grow up with sleet and overcast skies to fully appreciate the danger of the vision espoused by people like Tucker Carlson. Kevin can't conceive these loons could possibly be serious. But they are. Deadly so.
Aren't tge skies are always overcast in CA now because of the smoke?
Myself I think the actual reason is that he's retired and childless. Very different perspective.
You make an excellent point but I'd go further. Kevin is not only retired and childless but is also well off and male of northern European heritage. His worldview is warped by this, unlike the Black realtor who was arrested along with his father and son clients for the crime of house hunting while black.
I read somewhere else where T. Carlson was late to Orban worship party - so which is it? Is he a non-entity or the future of the conservative movement. On a historical basis, how close were they to Nazism during WW2? I know the genocide hit really hard there so I imagine Hungary always being kind of right wing.
Hungary during WWII was allied with the Axis powers, they also had a Fascist government.
New Naziism seriously wants to be an international thing.
Steve Bannon recently tried to establish some kind of wanna-be-a-Nazi academy in, I think, an abandoned monastery in Italy before the Italians kicked him out as an obvious troublemaker.
I respectfully disagree. Calling right-wingers "Hungarians" and suggesting they "Go back to Hungary with Tucker Carlson if they hate democracy so much" is something I'm looking forward to.
I don’t think Tucker had his Hungarian love fest in order to upset liberals. I think he did it because he admires autocrats. It’s a nice easy pitch, which we should hit out of the park.
Having been Budapest a couple of times over the last five years I would say I can't imagine how Carlson could draw any comparison between its government and the U.S.
I mean, Budapest is a great vacation in the same sense as Cancun. Budapest is really scenic and cheap by US standards, and fine if you don't care about the corruption surrounding it, and Cancun is really scenic and cheap by US standards, and fine if you don't mind being surrounded by poverty and a country partially run by cartels.
If Hungary was not party of the EU, I mean, good luck even going there on vacation. I should, just for the hell if it, find out what Carlson is on about, but I don't think I will.
Oh, if Republicans have anything to do with it, they would turn the US into Hungary in a second: xenophobic, anti-LGTBQ, religious fundamentalist, no free press, no serious opposition parties allowed, cult of the Dear Leader, the whole enchilada. What's not to love?
Not sure how your belief that Fox News is The Problem, and ignoring these stories, come together. I think Fox News's track record of normalizing crazy means this should be taken seriously.
google "independent state legislature doctrine."
Orban rails at "EU values" while happily taking EU checks like an Alama Trumpist railing at "New York values" while happily taking New York checks.
Conservatives admire and promote utter failure in all things because it makes them feel better about themselves.
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